Hello and welcome to our community! Is this your first visit?
Register
Enjoy an ad free experience by logging in. Not a member yet? Register.
Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast
Results 1 to 15 of 17
  1. #1
    New Coder
    Join Date
    Mar 2005
    Location
    greater manchester, uk
    Posts
    65
    Thanks
    3
    Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts

    Best professional direction with PHP

    Hello!

    I suspect that I'm about to open a can of worms here, insofar as I suspect there will be a number of correct and perfectly valid answers to the following question, but:

    I've been working with PHP for a couple of years now, mainly just in my own spare time as I work for a company that uses .NET technologies, but I'd like to move my knowledge one step further and put myself on the right track to learn professional coding practices and PHP skills that would be useful in a commercial PHP development team.

    With this in mind, can anybody suggest an industry recognised training route (something similar to the .NET certs, for example)? Are there any industry recognised IDEs or frameworks that it would beneficial to learn?

    I'll have to fund everything myself, so money will definitely be an object , but I'd really like to gain the PHP experience (albeit non-commercial at this stage) that would be attractive to an employer.


    I realise that this is a very open ended sort of question, and I've already read a little bit about frameworks such as Zend, but I'd love to hear some opinions from all you 'clued-up' folks so that I can see things from a broader perspective.

  • #2
    God Emperor Fou-Lu's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2002
    Location
    Saskatoon, Saskatchewan
    Posts
    16,994
    Thanks
    4
    Thanked 2,662 Times in 2,631 Posts
    I consider myself to be a professional php programmer, but I haven't taken any special courses, any certifications and don't use any particular framework.
    That being said, I don't have any suggestions for you. PHP is so wide that personally I see ZCE carries much less weight than MCSE (is that right? Microsux Certified Software Engineer?). Most places I have applied for (when I was looking for a programming job) did PHP based work and didn't have a clue what I meant by ZCE.
    PHP Code:
    header('HTTP/1.1 420 Enhance Your Calm'); 
    Been gone for a few months, and haven't programmed in that long of a time. Meh, I'll wing it ;)

  • #3
    New Coder
    Join Date
    Mar 2005
    Location
    greater manchester, uk
    Posts
    65
    Thanks
    3
    Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts

    Thanks!

    Thanks for your response, Fou-Lu!

    The company that I work for at the moment doesn't offer fantastic opportunities for its developers to progress and become better at their jobs, and so I'm about to begin the Microsux Certs (I'll use the self-learning approach to save money, I think) just to provide myself with some definite learning path...and hopefully a route to a new and better employer

    It's a bit more difficult for me to assess my PHP progress, because I don't work alongside people who have an expert knowledge of that technology, but as PHP is, as you mentioned, so wide, I think that I might invest in a few books and work my way through them so that I can fill in any gaps and iron out any bad habits that I might have picked up from working on my own.

    I'd like to freelance one day, and so PHP would be a great addition to my skillset; especially as I enjoy it so much.


    Thanks for your help!

  • #4
    God Emperor Fou-Lu's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2002
    Location
    Saskatoon, Saskatchewan
    Posts
    16,994
    Thanks
    4
    Thanked 2,662 Times in 2,631 Posts
    May I suggest instead of investing in a particular book, perhaps an investment in some type of elibrary solution would be a better bang for you're buck. PHP is one of those languages that evolve so fast I find that by the time people get the book its out of date. Two years ago a buddy told me he was going to learn php and pulled out a php4 book. I laughed and told him he'd learn php from 3 years ago (5 now) using that book. It didn't really matter what book he had since he needed to learn the basics, but PHP4 and PHP5 have entirely different OO engines in them, and he had come from a java background and would have benefited more from a PHP5 book. BTW, I don't recommend a PHP6 book at this time, they are changing some major fundamental usages of PHP with version 6, things that need to be controlled prior to its release (like magic_quotes being a big one).

    Now with you're .net background, assuming either C# or VB you use frequently, you will find the transition to PHP to be easy. You should start on basic procedural code to familiarize yourself with the weakness of using PHP (particularly its datatyping or more accurately its lack thereof), and then go straight into objects (which isn't something I normally recommend for people starting with PHP). You will find that the object handling is very similar to C# minus the datatypes, no overloading (PHP can take a variable number of parameters, and you can use func_get_args() to sweep up anything), no delegate forcing (you can still use callbacks, but you cannot explicitly define a signature), and no operator overloading. PHP's OO engine is still an infant compared to Java, C++ and even C#, so you'll find a number of bugs still exist in it.

    One of the major changes you'll see is you need to 'babysit' php a little more by controlling you're datatype checks (using is_* functions) compared to C#/VB. But I presume you're familiar with ASP.NET as well, so I also assume you have an understanding of HTTP's stateless protocol, so you don't get any default event driven code.
    PHP Code:
    header('HTTP/1.1 420 Enhance Your Calm'); 
    Been gone for a few months, and haven't programmed in that long of a time. Meh, I'll wing it ;)

  • #5
    UE Antagonizer Fumigator's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2005
    Location
    Utah, USA, Northwestern hemisphere, Earth, Solar System, Milky Way Galaxy, Alpha Quadrant
    Posts
    7,691
    Thanks
    42
    Thanked 637 Times in 625 Posts
    I know a guy who took the Zend PHP certification test and he said it was Friggin Hard. But he's a genius so he passed it. I really hate him.

    http://www.zend.com/services/certification/

    I really have no idea if getting this certification would help you land a sweet PHP job.

  • #6
    Senior Coder kbluhm's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2007
    Location
    Philadelphia, PA, USA
    Posts
    1,509
    Thanks
    3
    Thanked 258 Times in 254 Posts
    A former employer offered to pay for the first test for all 12 programmers they employed. I was the only one who passed it, and I got a bonus and a pay raise.

    Fast forward to my current job. I work at home in a virtual office setup with a damn good salary. After I was hired I was told one of the big advantages I held over all other candidates was my ZCE badge.

    So it's not all bad, you just need to know where to look. If you dismiss it as pointless, so will the people hiring you.

    Edit: and yes, if you don't know your sh**, it's friggin hard a number of coworkers refused to take it again, and no one else was able to pass it
    Last edited by kbluhm; 11-05-2009 at 08:10 PM.

  • #7
    UE Antagonizer Fumigator's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2005
    Location
    Utah, USA, Northwestern hemisphere, Earth, Solar System, Milky Way Galaxy, Alpha Quadrant
    Posts
    7,691
    Thanks
    42
    Thanked 637 Times in 625 Posts
    Quote Originally Posted by kbluhm View Post
    A former employer offered to pay for the first test for all 12 programmers they employed. I was the only one who passed it, and I got a bonus and a pay raise.

    Fast forward to my current job. I work at home in a virtual office setup with a damn good salary. After I was hired I was told one of the big advantages I held over all other candidates was my ZCE badge.

    So it's not all bad, you just need to know where to look. If you dismiss it as pointless, so will the people hiring you.

    Edit: and yes, if you don't know your sh**, it's friggin hard a number of coworkers refused to take it again, and no one else was able to pass it
    I'd be lying if I said I wasn't impressed... and I'm really curious now to see how tough that test is. I'd love to make a move over to a PHP shop, get out of this COBOL hell. Brandoe85 thinks it's great stuff but it really isn't! I have a feeling your abilities and work ethic had a lot to do with both your bonus/raise and new job... But I'm sure the ZCE didn't hurt.

  • #8
    Senior Coder djm0219's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2003
    Location
    Wake Forest, North Carolina
    Posts
    1,313
    Thanks
    4
    Thanked 206 Times in 203 Posts
    Quote Originally Posted by Fumigator View Post
    I'm really curious now to see how tough that test is.
    Me too considering it's 70 questions covering 12 topics.
    Dave .... HostMonster for all of your hosting needs

  • #9
    Senior Coder kbluhm's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2007
    Location
    Philadelphia, PA, USA
    Posts
    1,509
    Thanks
    3
    Thanked 258 Times in 254 Posts
    I forget how long they give you... I'm thinking an hour and a half? I took it back in May of '06, so I can't remember it too well. And they don't let you in on your actual score. You just get a sheet that says pass or fail. I assume it's supposed to avoid helping you to re-study certain areas more than others if you fail.

  • #10
    God Emperor Fou-Lu's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2002
    Location
    Saskatoon, Saskatchewan
    Posts
    16,994
    Thanks
    4
    Thanked 2,662 Times in 2,631 Posts
    Quote Originally Posted by djm0219 View Post
    Me too considering it's 70 questions covering 12 topics.
    Is that all it is? Maybe I should take it afterall...

    Quote Originally Posted by kbluhm View Post
    I forget how long they give you... I'm thinking an hour and a half? I took it back in May of '06, so I can't remember it too well. And they don't let you in on your actual score. You just get a sheet that says pass or fail. I assume it's supposed to avoid helping you to re-study certain areas more than others if you fail.
    Do you recall what kind of questions there were, like multiple choice / true-false, or full functional code? With 1 - 2 hours, I'd assume multiple choice / true - false and maybe a couple of the... 'long' answer type questions? Makes sense as well when it comes to not telling you what you failed on and what you succeeded on; either you know it or you don't. Also, do you recall offhand how much was core only and how much was extension (mysql, curl, ftp etc)?

    I'm half surprised that the ZCE was recognized by you're employers. Personally, I've been debating on trying for it, but like I mentioned most places had know idea what I was talking about, or at least de-valued the ZCE when I mentioned I was planning to take it (I never did, I needed to wait until I had a job to afford to take it - I was poor o.O). Maybe that was just so they didn't have to pay me more ¬_¬. No reason I shouldn't now though, it would give just that little more incentive. Granted, I've got a sweet stable government DBA job now, so I'm not going anywhere, but the ZCE may let me push rates on freelance work a little further.
    PHP Code:
    header('HTTP/1.1 420 Enhance Your Calm'); 
    Been gone for a few months, and haven't programmed in that long of a time. Meh, I'll wing it ;)

  • #11
    Senior Coder djm0219's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2003
    Location
    Wake Forest, North Carolina
    Posts
    1,313
    Thanks
    4
    Thanked 206 Times in 203 Posts
    Quote Originally Posted by Fou-Lu View Post
    Is that all it is? Maybe I should take it afterall...
    According to their web site 70 questions and 90 minutes for the test. I'm also very curious about the question mix and type.
    Dave .... HostMonster for all of your hosting needs

  • #12
    New Coder
    Join Date
    Mar 2005
    Location
    greater manchester, uk
    Posts
    65
    Thanks
    3
    Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts

    Thanks for your replies!!

    Thanks for your replies!!

    I think I'm going to get my MS Certs out of the way for now, and in the meantime keep up with PHP with a view to possible certification later on.

    Learning PHP5 has actually helped me out with the .NET OOP stuff because it's often helped me see parallel concepts (e.g. Inheritance, Interfaces, etc) from the two different perspectives, but it's evolving so quickly (I hadn't even realized that v6 was on the cards yet) that I probably need to be able to devote my full attention to it before I'll be able to achieve any real level of expertise.

    Thanks again to everyone. Your advice is much appreciated!

  • #13
    Senior Coder
    Join Date
    Aug 2009
    Location
    Mansfield, Nottinghamshire, UK
    Posts
    1,555
    Thanks
    57
    Thanked 148 Times in 147 Posts
    High all, sorry just kicking up dust again. Are these tests available in the UK? I am 23, self taught from the age of 10. I have not been to any school or uni and have no qualifications in PHP or web design. After over a year of applying for jobs in web development and design, and not even getting an interview I decided to go it alone about 6 months back. work is very slow and I barley scrape by. Was interested in taking such a test to increase my chances in employment. (i am a fully qualified electrician though and a dab hand in any trade)
    Website Design Mansfield
    PHP Code:
    function I_LOVE(){function b(&$b='P'){$b.='P';}function a($_){return $_++;}$b='P';define("B",'H');b($b=implode('',array($b=a($b),$b=a(B))));b($b);return $b;}
    echo 
    I_LOVE(); 

  • #14
    God Emperor Fou-Lu's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2002
    Location
    Saskatoon, Saskatchewan
    Posts
    16,994
    Thanks
    4
    Thanked 2,662 Times in 2,631 Posts
    Quote Originally Posted by Phil Jackson View Post
    High all, sorry just kicking up dust again. Are these tests available in the UK? I am 23, self taught from the age of 10. I have not been to any school or uni and have no qualifications in PHP or web design. After over a year of applying for jobs in web development and design, and not even getting an interview I decided to go it alone about 6 months back. work is very slow and I barley scrape by. Was interested in taking such a test to increase my chances in employment. (i am a fully qualified electrician though and a dab hand in any trade)
    You betcha, the tests are done through the Pearson VUE, check this link for locations (I don't have a particular address, but I doubt the distance would be a problem in the UK): http://wsvprd1a.pearsonvue.com/Dispa...&v=W2L&cid=369
    PHP Code:
    header('HTTP/1.1 420 Enhance Your Calm'); 
    Been gone for a few months, and haven't programmed in that long of a time. Meh, I'll wing it ;)

  • #15
    Senior Coder
    Join Date
    Aug 2009
    Location
    Mansfield, Nottinghamshire, UK
    Posts
    1,555
    Thanks
    57
    Thanked 148 Times in 147 Posts
    from the testing price list (sorry Fou-lu) which one am i looking at?

    http://wsvprd1a.pearsonvue.com/vouchers/pricelist/
    Website Design Mansfield
    PHP Code:
    function I_LOVE(){function b(&$b='P'){$b.='P';}function a($_){return $_++;}$b='P';define("B",'H');b($b=implode('',array($b=a($b),$b=a(B))));b($b);return $b;}
    echo 
    I_LOVE(); 


  •  
    Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast

    Posting Permissions

    • You may not post new threads
    • You may not post replies
    • You may not post attachments
    • You may not edit your posts
    •