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Thread: Frame problem.

  1. #1
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    Frame problem.

    I have 2 frames side by side.
    <frameset cols="*,3*">
    <frame frameborder="no" scrolling="no" name="leftpanel" src="leftpanel.htm" marginwidth="0" marginheight="0">
    <frame frameborder="no" scrolling="auto" name="rightpanel" src="rightpanel.htm" marginwidth="0" marginheight="0">
    </frameset>
    I need a frame above these that goes the width of the browser. I've tried nesting a frameset inside these but no go. I've even tried to put a 1 x 1 table above it. No go. Need help.

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    Regular Coder Pepe, the bull's Avatar
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    Code:
    <html>
    
    <frameset rows="50%,50%">
    
    <frame src="frame_a.htm">
    
    <frameset cols="25%,75%">
    <frame src="frame_b.htm">
    <frame src="frame_c.htm">
    </frameset>
    
    </frameset>
    
    </html>
    I think it's called a mixed frameset. I took this example from W3Schools.
    Last edited by Pepe, the bull; 11-18-2008 at 07:14 PM.
    Pepe, the bull

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    The fat guy next door VIPStephan's Avatar
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    *shudder*

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    That didn't work. The 2 columns show up but not the top row. Frontpage even removed the 2nd 50% argument from the first frameset.

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    Regular Coder Pepe, the bull's Avatar
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    I'm not sure what to tell you. If Frontpage is changing stuff, that might be part of the problem. The code I gave you works. I haven't really had much luck with frames, and I usually try to avoid them at all costs. Are you sure you need to use them? Or could you use a CSS layout?
    Pepe, the bull

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    Regular Coder Doctor_Varney's Avatar
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    I think your main problem with frames...

    ...is frames.
    Definition: Computer rage is a heightened physiological response with associated feelings of anger and frustration[1] resulting from using a computer or other complex electronic device. It may result in the physical assault of the computer or similar item.[2] Computer use often leads to verbal abuse and occasionally physical violence towards the object.[3] Computer rage may be caused by distress due to a hardware or software problem which the enraged person is unable to correct.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Doctor_Varney View Post
    I think your main problem with frames...

    ...is frames.
    Not very helpful, but I have to agree - if the only consideration is for layout, you really should consider using CSS.

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    Yep, frames is a pain in the @$$. The reason I decided to use frames is this: I have a header, footer and sidebar that remain constant. The only part that is variable is the remaining space(scrolling is also variable). And the loading time and transition of the variable info is seemless. You don't get that "blink" when a page is loading. To me, have multible copies of a page that differ only slightly in content is a waist of loading time and space. Obviously, I'm going about this all wrong. And could possibly have no idea of what I'm writing about. Would having a table with a cell that links to an object, where said object is variable, be the way to go? Or use <iframe></iframe> in a cell?
    Last edited by BOBCO; 11-19-2008 at 05:58 PM.

  • #9
    The fat guy next door VIPStephan's Avatar
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    Haha, what irony to fix the frameset issue with a layout table.

    Anyway, iframes are better than complete framesets but they are still frames. If you want the same functionality you should look into dynamic inclusion of HTML with JS and PHP (a. k. a. “AJAX”): http://dynamicdrive.com/dynamicindex17/ajaxcontent.htm

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    Regular Coder Doctor_Varney's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by tosbourn View Post
    Not very helpful, but I have to agree - if the only consideration is for layout, you really should consider using CSS.
    Well...

    Quote Originally Posted by BOBCO
    I have a header, footer and sidebar that remain constant. The only part that is variable is the remaining space(scrolling is also variable)...

    You don't get that "blink" when a page is loading. To me, have multible copies of a page that differ only slightly in content is a waist of loading time and space.
    Well, with CSS, you can have multiple repeating elements. You just give them an ID and specify their rules (instructions for display) once only, in the stylesheet.

    You can also apply scrolling to DIVs in their styling. The reasons you have gone for a frameset layout are also good reasons to start learning and using CSS.

    Okay, so your HTML must have multiple copies of some things, across all pages. Whose site doesn't? Well, that's what >copy< & >paste< are for. It's usually still a lot less "stuff" than having old-skool HTML repeatedly loading it's presentation, as well as the content.

    I can't speak for yours, obviously, but many sites often have only the navbar and header set static, for instance. If this is the case with yours, then you can specify background images and styling only once in the stylesheet. The advantages you're citing aren't really strong enough reasons for choosing a frames layout over a CSS one.

    Quote Originally Posted by BOBCO
    Yep, frames is a pain in the @$$.
    Ah, there you are, you see... Now, if you are (as it would appear) inexperienced at writing framesets, you may be looking to spend many more stressful hours, trying to poke things into submission, with the added inevitibility of cross browser & resolution issues. Then there is the possibility, that if you want to take web-publishing seriously, you'll have to learn CSS one day, anyway... So, it might be best to quit now and start fresh with CSS. Unless, of course, you've absolutely GOT to get it finished by next week and resolving the problem is just a matter of a few percent here or there in the code.

    The best use of frames I can think of, is for making sites which demonstrate how bad frames can be, to put people off using them (I do think they have their uses, in intranets or local systems, for instance, where one knows exactly the screen conditions they are headed for.)

    Finally, in answer to your loading time issue: Properly made CSS and lean, semantic HTML simply loads faster than cluttered HTML anyway - and indeed, I think, exhibits faster and more efficient memory usage than with frame loading. Additionally, frames are the fast way to diminish your site's searchability and engine ranking, on the www.

    As for table layouts... Well, I've found they take a hell of a long time to load (and look quite horrible, while they're doing so).

    At the end of the day, it's just my opinion and you don't have to follow it and - although I haven't actually sorted out your frames problem directly, I sincerely hope that explanation is (or will be someday) helpful to you in the long run.

    Last edited by Doctor_Varney; 11-20-2008 at 01:47 AM.
    Definition: Computer rage is a heightened physiological response with associated feelings of anger and frustration[1] resulting from using a computer or other complex electronic device. It may result in the physical assault of the computer or similar item.[2] Computer use often leads to verbal abuse and occasionally physical violence towards the object.[3] Computer rage may be caused by distress due to a hardware or software problem which the enraged person is unable to correct.

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    Regular Coder Doctor_Varney's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by VIPStephan View Post
    Haha, what irony to fix the frameset issue with a layout table.
    Yes, I have to agree, it made me smile, too... Though, I doubt our OP came here in the hopes of being laughed at.

    Last edited by Doctor_Varney; 11-20-2008 at 01:50 AM.
    Definition: Computer rage is a heightened physiological response with associated feelings of anger and frustration[1] resulting from using a computer or other complex electronic device. It may result in the physical assault of the computer or similar item.[2] Computer use often leads to verbal abuse and occasionally physical violence towards the object.[3] Computer rage may be caused by distress due to a hardware or software problem which the enraged person is unable to correct.

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    Regular Coder jamesicus's Avatar
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    Web Content Accessibility (for People with Disabilities) considerations when using frames:

    http://www.scotconnect.com/Training/frames.php
    http://www.webaim.org/techniques/frames/
    http://www.at.ufl.edu/accessibility/...es/frames.html

    JFP
    Web Developer Tool Kit - for creating Standards compliant and Interoperable web pages
    W3C Markup Validation Service - validate HTML code for reliable rendering in all Browsers
    WAVE accessibility evaluation tool - check page structure, image alt text, form labels, etc.

  • #13
    Regular Coder Doctor_Varney's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jamesicus View Post
    Web Content Accessibility (for People with Disabilities) considerations when using frames:

    http://www.scotconnect.com/Training/frames.php
    http://www.webaim.org/techniques/frames/
    http://www.at.ufl.edu/accessibility/...es/frames.html

    JFP
    I'm not disabled but...

    "As yet there has been no test case in the UK however in Australia and America lack large organisations have been successfully challenged - including Sydney Olympic Committee and America On Line. The Sydney Olympic Comittee was successfully taken to Court because disabled people could not access their Web site and AOL when challenged develope their America Online Accessibility Policy."
    ...Do you think I could take the author of this site to court...?
    Because, I experienced a little er... difficulty accessing all of the words.

    Last edited by Doctor_Varney; 11-20-2008 at 02:34 AM.
    Definition: Computer rage is a heightened physiological response with associated feelings of anger and frustration[1] resulting from using a computer or other complex electronic device. It may result in the physical assault of the computer or similar item.[2] Computer use often leads to verbal abuse and occasionally physical violence towards the object.[3] Computer rage may be caused by distress due to a hardware or software problem which the enraged person is unable to correct.

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    New Coder Ibanez's Avatar
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    I find IFrames quite useful from time to time... Although google doesnt like them very much, but that can be fixed with a small JS

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    I ended up using a single <iframe>. Works well. But I haven't tried it across any other platforms other than IE. With todays machines, taking into account speed and memory/disk usage probably aren't as critical as it was back in the day when your code was limited to 64k and your hard drive was the size of a shoe box.
    I will get a book on CSS. Must update my DOS era mind also.


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