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Thread: SEO trick?

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    Senior Coder timgolding's Avatar
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    SEO trick?

    In the past an SEO trick that was used for adding content that search engines would read but would be hidden from the user; was to simply give the texts' parent box a css attribute of display:hidden;. However popular belief tells you not to do this anymore as Google picks it up as key word stuffing. Are there any tricks here that Google won't picks up on. The problem is i have a site with good content behind. A lot of text descriptions for a bunch of ranges that are displayed on the page. However the boss thinks we are including to much good text content at the expense of usibilty. He wants to take this text out and just have the clickable images to go through to that range. However I am worried that this will affect ranking because it will lose some text content that relates to our targeted keyword.

    I had an idea that I could put the text in different boxes at the bottom of the page give them an absolute positioning of right:10000px; so they would be displayed off the page. No one would see them but maybe google would still read that important text. Would Google pick up on this? Is this a good/bad idea? Are there any other ideas?
    You can not say you know how to do something, until you can teach it to someone else.

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    Supreme Master coder! abduraooft's Avatar
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    The Webmaster guidelines published by google may help you.
    The Dream is not what you see in sleep; Dream is the thing which doesn't let you sleep. --(Dr. APJ. Abdul Kalam)

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    timgolding (07-23-2009)

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    What a terrible boss! It sounds to me like a non-IT boss telling the IT-people the technical details of their job. It's because in the bureaucratic chain the lowest secretary or footsoldier salesperson has no more or less talent and technical knowledge than the highest boss - it's the engineering and production people who actually know stuff that other people don't know - eg the way you know what makes a page genuinely "optimised for search engines" and your boss wants you to do less than the optimum. Since you know what real SEO is, and you do, because you know that you don't want to do anything that is either immoral or makes google think you are immoral (the latter category may apply to your situations, due to your boss's apparent stubborn fascism), perhaps you should stealthily create your own wealth and leave your boss to fend for himself. Let him write the coding if he's so keen on it, and let him take responsibility for the dropped traffic, or her.

    I wrote this article (so nosey parkers will be able to figure out what my sites are now - but not for up to a month or two, since I only just published the article) and it helps differentiate between SEO and SRM which are different things - there's really no such thing as an "seo trick" - it's either seo or, if it's a trick, it's SRM.

    Most SEO is not really seo.
    Okay, a lot of people waste hours and hours of their lives spamming links to their site all over 1000s of forums, blogs and other "unsuspecting" pages (of total ****), from twitter to facebook to any number of other malignant sites full of bile and rank rubbish, in order to "fool" google (mainly) into thinking many more people like that page than is true - thus causing artificial boosting of results. Then the lame ******* braindead gimps call this thing they do SEO. Which is such a bollocks thing to do but those of us who practise real seo don't really dispel the myth far and wide because after all we don't want anyone to figure out what real seo is since that leads to instant profit and power, and no one wants to share that.

    Search Result Manipulation
    Manipulating search results is immoral (the search engine companies work hard to make genuine search algorithms which match patterns properly) and it is stupid (your users will look at your pages and most of them will think you are a ****head and will go away, even though your pathetic pay-per-click ads will still yield regular cash out of a minority of them which, if you spam hard enough, yields a lot of cash) and has no longterm potential (first and foremost, google will have as its objective a strong desire to find you and eliminate your pages). Those who do it are stupid and have no faith in technology. To spend that much energy doing something intelligent would certainly make real money, and a lot of it, but the way these gits work they will never learn to make real valuable traffic "for free".

    The art of Search Engine Optimisation
    Okay, if you think general rules, gossip-spread rules, any other kind of mathematical guesswork etc can help you figure out making pages more findable, you are stupider than I thought. The only real way to understand how to make pages better for search engines is to figure out how to make pages better for users, how to make pages truly relevant to the search terms you want them found under - THEN they will be found under such terms! Isn't that just ****ing obvious? I mean, if a search engine is built to find the most relevant match for some query, being the most relevant result, or tending in that direction, is obviously the only way to "optimise" your page. If you stick to this rule, you will make a lot of money. If you imagine I'm going to tell you exactly what that means, do all the work for you, you don't understand. It's about YOU and YOUR PAGES - if they are pages that should be found, they will be found. So to optimise a network of information for search engines all you have to do is make that network of information, real information, valid information, helpful information. If you do anything else, you are just a pointless idiot really.




    So there you go - you're doing it the right way. Present your boss with 2 possible outcomes - one with less traffic and more suited to his demands, and one with more traffic, because technical people decided how to do the technical work rather than nontechnical people, who are good at deciding whose turn it is to make tea, who are good at allocating lists of who should wash the dishes today, what time you should clock in and out, and even other trivial stuff like who is in charge of this or that project and co-ordinates the staff who fill the spreadsheets up with information and make phonecalls in between drinking tea and doing the dishes. And now they have email addresses they all think they're bloody bill gates. Being able to type an @ symbol doesn't make you a programmer. (Related thought: is facebook just a social spreadsheet?)
    Last edited by RabidMango; 07-24-2009 at 03:51 PM. Reason: repairing a typo

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    timgolding (07-23-2009)

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    Senior Coder timgolding's Avatar
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    Yeah I'm always up against it at my work. I've been having these discussions at work and pretty much told them the most important thing is the content that goes behind the site, along with a good generic domain. But who am i to say I'm just a web designer. Well they basically said that they are the sales people and they decide how the site works and how it should be. So I am stuck against it really. But thanks for all your info. RabidMango you made me . They did give me a slight compromise in that if any category has 4 or less ranges i can still use my list view keeping the text content. If more than 4 then I'm stuck with blocks of images and small titles underneath them then some innerHTML text swapping at the top when they hover over the images (which I suspect google will ignore, hopefully not penalise me). Oh well at least the rest of the site has good content behind a good domain.

    Edit:
    abduraooft: Have you got any similar links for yahoo or bing?


    P.S I suspect facebook is a sophisticated data mine.
    Last edited by timgolding; 07-23-2009 at 07:04 PM.
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    Supreme Master coder! abduraooft's Avatar
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    Edit:
    abduraooft: Have you got any similar links for yahoo or bing?
    Google gives http://help.yahoo.com/l/us/yahoo/search/webmaster/, though haven't checked
    The Dream is not what you see in sleep; Dream is the thing which doesn't let you sleep. --(Dr. APJ. Abdul Kalam)

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    timgolding (07-24-2009)

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    Senior Coder tomws's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Amazon1 View Post
    Customized SEO trick #2: You need lots of backlinks to your web site
    You mean like those you're creating in your posts here? With your smiley image linked back to your site and surrounded by relevant-sounding text? Oh wait - but you fail with the "propagate in a natural fashion" advice. Tricks, alright.
    Are you a Help Vampire?

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    The Apostate Apostropartheid's Avatar
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    Well, he's gone now, though I daresay the Report Post function would be better next time ^^
    *starts singing*

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    Senior Coder tomws's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by CyanLight View Post
    Well, he's gone now, though I daresay the Report Post function would be better next time ^^
    *starts singing*
    I did that, too.
    Are you a Help Vampire?

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    It's a bad idea. Because it's a hidden text after all. A hidden text is a text that a user can't see with his/her naked eyes
    A hidden text is a known Google penalty. Even Googlebot don't aware of that you're using hidden text and one of your competitors find that you're using a hidden text...

    Your competitor is going to report this to Google and you'll lose your SEO power and SERP in Google organic search results.
    Last edited by oracleguy; 08-28-2009 at 05:15 PM.


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